A fellow judge and I recently had a conversation with a local TO about compensating his judges for Regular REL events, which, up to this point, he has not been doing. For this prerelease, and some before it, he has given us reduced entry and snacks and drinks for the day. He has expressed concern about cash compensation for weekly Regular REL events such as FNM and other weekly events. I informed him that there were other options, and he asked for more information. So I decided to turn the question over to fellow judges. How, if at all, are you compensated for regular REL events? So far, options that have been mentioned have included free or reduced entry, and sealed product per head. What are stores out there doing for you?

http://apps.magicjudges.org/forum/topic/15414/

Personally, I wouldn't take anything for FNM, etc. other than maaaaybe free
entry. Depends on the situation though. Mostly based on size of the events,
expectation of you to be there as a judge, etc.

Prereleases, I would care more about, but if the store's only getting 16
people out or something, and they're not making out like bandits, then I'm
just there to enjoy myself. I've gotten free entry in the past, and I've
considered asking for product based on size (150+ person prereleases, 4
judges), but it's not really a big deal for me at Regular REL.

2015-09-27 9:46 GMT-04:00 Jacen Simon <forum-21547-b084@apps.magicjudges.org

Depends on your role. I know at my FMN's (typically 40+ people) I will take,on average, 1-2 calls and that's it. I'm not required to input round results, or keep a list of how the previous rounds are finished up (incase WER crashes). Also, this is just for my LGS, players know what the prize payouts are going to be and it would cost the store money to give free entry or pay a judge that in honesty doesn't do much.

FNMs: 20€ (ca. 23$) per night and free entry to all tournaments.
Monthly tournament series: 60€ (ca. 67$) per day for each judge of a team of 2, additional cash if there are many players.
Prereleases: 60-80€ (67$ - 90$) per day for each judge of a team of 2, depending on how many players show up.

All compensation can be provided in the form of store credit due to tax reasons.


Please know that my lgs has a huge community and many many players show up each and every week. I don't think a small store can provide that much compensation.

Edited Jasper König (Sept. 27, 2015 01:30:14 PM)

In my case pretty much #2 for what Brock said.

I get nothing for any REG event, because the store owner is doing product distribution and WER on his own. So I'm only there to play and answer the occasional 1-2 judge calls each day. Additionaly my store knows he is not required to have a judge at REG events, so he isn't willing to pay for it, simple as that.

Ultimately I think a global conversation about compensation at regular isn't going to be very helpful.

I can't expect France, Japan and Wisconsin to be very similar.

I would focus this conversation in one of your regional groups, where you can more reasonably expect similarities.

I will add one thing: get some sort of compensation. Free drinks, free entry, packs, ability to buy FTV sets at MSRP.

If you work for free, you are going to find it increasingly difficult to start getting paid later. If you want the TO to value your time, start with *you* valuing your time. Consider how to market yourself and what you can bring to his/her business. Stores with events run by certified judges tend to have events that rate higher in player satisfaction and have more players. You have marketing power. Use it.
But be prepared to walk away. TOs love it when judges sacrifice their time for the “ good of the community” instead of pay.

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Originally posted by Juergen Wierz:

In my case pretty much #2 for what Brock said.

I get nothing for any REG event, because the store owner is doing product distribution and WER on his own. So I'm only there to play and answer the occasional 1-2 judge calls each day.

This makes a huge difference. In my store, the judges not only answer the calls, but they enter the players into the tournaments, enter all the results, collect the participation fee and they even distribute product for limited tournaments and prizes for the winners. We do that so the TO has more time for selling cards and other products.

Ofc this makes a huge difference, that's why I agreed with Brock. Your compensation should reflect the amount of work you do besides just being there. And in my opinion it is also clear that a store with 10 people FNM can't spend anything on a judge.

Besides that, I have to second Bryan as well: a global conversation about compensation at regular isn't going to be very helpful, since player numbers, attandence fee, work conditions, usual judge compensation and many more things differ too much.

Even if you usually get only one or two calls for that tournament, it dosen't mean that tournament don't need you. I understand Store Owner don't want to pay cash for FNM judge, but still you can offer free entry or some packs. “There is certified judge here” is already a value for that tournament.

As Bryan said, if you working for free, it cause (some negative) effect. One, you cannot get paid for same work forever. Two, other judges will be said like “other judges are not paid for your work, so we also don't pay for you”.

If you want to work for free because you know TO very well, please say “I shuould get some packs or free entry for my work usually, but me and you are close friend, so this is special offer only between me and you”.

In my opinion you should not be going into judging for the purpose of
what you earn out of it. Judging is not employment but something you do
because you enjoy it particularly at REG events where the IPG and other
technicalities are not required.

What compensation if any is a matter between any particular TO and the
Judge. I know some people who are happy to do it for nothing and others
that get product. There are no hard and fast rules nor there should be.

Graham Theobalds



On 27/09/2015 21:49, Juergen Wierz wrote:

At FNM I get free drinks and snacks whilst acting as a judge; sometimes reduced entry (but the public price is already very low). I don't see it as an issue as the TO does all the scorekeeping and logistics, and I answer maybe 4 rules calls.

I would also be considered on the “most regular” tier of players for access to FTV and similar, should I want them.

I get free entry and free drinks, although I do pay for product in sealed and draft. On top of that I get a store discount, including early access to FtV and similar products at a good price. Since I already bring a good amount of money to the store a discount for me is as good as cash in hand :-)

The store owner handles sanctioning of events, I do the logistics for limited product distribution and half of the scorekeeping (usually I read out the results, he clicks the buttons, this happens to work out in the store's setup) and so on, but overall my FNM-style duties as a judge are light as well. Group size is usually 16-24.

For Regular, I usually just take the Judge calls and occasionally help with WER, so I just do that while playing and don't worry about compensation. For most of the Competitive REL events, my local TO could judge those himself, so I'm basically stepping in for experience to add to my judging resume (though I usually get free drinks and pizza for it). Since I'm working towards L2 and my TO has no intention of going that far, we have discussed compensation for when I'm able to run the tournaments that he can't, but that's a ways off, though I do like the preliminary discussion.

Edited Hank Wiest (Sept. 28, 2015 09:11:08 AM)

This is interesting I was exactly looking for something like this!

I get to do more or less everything in a new place, starting from teaching a lot of new players before the start of the tournament. Since most players are new ones, I get A LOT of questions!
Of course I do everything else and I was wondering what I should ask for. (Since I never actually judge much outside one or 2 FNM as a second judge in case of)

It's not my primary concern, but like it was said I value my time a lot, and have MANY things I already do beside those.

I was thinking about 50€ for an evening (about 19h-23h) which seemed cheap but I also get free drinks and food.
Maybe I'll have to lower this a bit.

Thank you for the previous inputs.

FNM is usually reduced (or sometimes free) entry, as we draft.

For prereleases, it's free entry and a box for the weekend. This time around we actually upped the offering to five events, and I covered three of them, including the Saturday midnight. Prerelease usually includes a meal.

In either case, I get drinks and snacks on the house.

I'm pretty happy with the arrangement.