Good morning judges! Welcome to another new edition of the Knowledge Pool. This question is Bronze, which means it is focused on education for L1 judges. L2+ judges please feel free to direct the discussion in a positive way.

http://blogs.magicjudges.org/knowledgepool/?p=690

Mulch or Fiction - BRONZE

Amy and Nicholas are playing at a Pro Tour Qualifier and during Amy's turn she casts Mulch revealing the top 5 cards, which are 4 copies of Grizzly Bears and then a Plains, in that order.

Realizing her error immediately, Amy laughs and shows Nicholas a Grisly Salvage from her hand, which she was thinking about when she revealed the fifth card. Amy calls out “Judge!”

During the investigation, you discover that Terminus has been cast and a Glory Seeker is on the bottom of Amy's library. What is the most appropriate infraction, penalty, and any additional fix?

Edited Benjamin McDole (May 8, 2013 12:53:18 PM)

I'd say this is a case of GPE - Looking at Extra Cards (IPG 2.2), which comes with a Warning.
Extracting from the definition,
“…catching a play error before the card is placed into his or her hand.”
the scenario mentioned would fit into the definition, as there was a play error committed (revealing 5 cards instead of 4 for Mulch), but the card has yet to be placed into Amy's hand.
As a result, one extra card was revealed in the process (Plains).
For this, the Plains should be shuffled back into the deck, maintaining Glory Seeker's position at the bottom of her deck from a previous Terminus, and probably any other possible “legally known” cards in the library.

I am not sure if this is a GPE - Looking at extra cards, or GPE - GRV. However, I believe both result in a warning and the same fix. Set aside the 4 grizzly bears that got mulched, and the glory seeker that we know is on the bottom of the library from the Terminus. Shuffle the rest of the deck to remedy, and then finish resolving the mulch. Issue Amy a warning.

I would treat this as GPE - L@EC

4 Bears get mulched - place them in the graveyard
Set the Glory Seeker aside, and randomize Amy's library.
Put the Glory Seeker back on the bottom of Amy's library
Continue Resolving Mulch
Issue Amy a warning

I feel like GPE - Looking at Extra Cards is the right infraction as it similar to the example given in the IPG of Sensei's divining top so I don't believe GPE -GRV is correct. No actions have been taken beyond the point where the fifth card was revealed and Amy called the judge on herself so no reason to deviate on the penalty so a warning should be appropriate.

For the fix confirm that no other cards are known beyond the Glory Seeker and then set aside the Glory Seeker and have Amy shuffle the Plains back into her library and the place the Glory Seeker back on the bottom once she is finished.

This one seems pretty straightforward. It's GPE-L@EC which gives a Warning. Amy should shuffle the randomized portion of her library and place the Glory Seeker back on the bottom. As I was walking away from the table, I'd also marvel at the fact that all four Grizzly Bears were next to each other in the library.

Don't forget that she also showed her Grisly Salvage to her opponent. No infraction is commited here, but I think it's important to stretch out to Amy that if she makes a mistake (even in a GPT) she isn't obliged to explain why she made the mistake to her opponent, and certainly may not show her cards in her hand to her opponent unless a card says otherwise like Duress.

Actually, players are allowed to show hidden information they have acces to
to anyone they want. So showing cards from hand (or from library during
tutoring) is perfectly fine and can be part of strategy or mind trick.


2013/5/10 Natalie Heylen <forum-4140-fd74@apps.magicjudges.org>

Welcome back to Knowledge Pool! Thank you to those who participated this week! And now for our solution:

What we have here (as many of you nailed) is a Looking at Extra Cards infraction. It's very tempting to call this a Game Rules Violation, however what has actually happened here is looking at too many cards. Remember that really all Game Play Errors are Games Rule Violations, it's our job to see if they fit more appropriately into another infraction.

Now on to what this implies. Since Amy has committed Looking at Extra Cards, she receives a warning. We also have the additional fix of offsetting the information she has gained. The Grizzly Bears were revealed correctly, and as such can remain where they are. The Plains on the other hand needs to be reinserted into the library. In order to accomplish this we first (in accordance with the IPG) set aside any known cards, in this case Glory Seeker, re-randomize the library and then replace Glory Seeker on the bottom. The players may then continue happily! As for Nicholas, since the players called a judge quickly after the error happened, and before advantage could be gained, Failure to Maintain Gamestate does not apply.

Please check in tomorrow for another exciting scenario!