Hello comrades.

I'm not completely sure if this question should fit in here or policy. I'll just toss it here and maybe uncle Scott can take it in case is not the right place.

This might seem like a corner case, and mostly it is, though part of it actually happened at a local tournament.

So lets assume we are during the end-of-round procedure and turns have been called. In one of the matches, turn 2 for example, the active player uses Karn Liberated last ability. What happens?

What I think it would happen is that the match would end. Karn's ability ends the current game (as stated on the rules for restarting a game) but End-of-Match Procedure states that no new games may start, so the logical conclusion would be the match ends. Would this be the right approach? if not, would the restarted game resume the turn the ended game was on? This happened at a tournament.

On a related question, what would happen in the case of a Shahrazad and turns? if you cast Shahrazad during EoR procedure, does it do anything at all? does anyone lose life? What if the turns end during the subgame? This happened at a casual commander match.

And now, for the corner case, what would happen if you cast Shahrazad, then within the subgame time is called and during turns you use Karn's last ability? Does the universe implode?

The MTR states that, once time has been called, no new games can begin. There's some hair-splitting arguments possible as to whether Karn is starting a new game, or re-starting the current game, but I agree with your assessment; this match is over. Further, the Gatherer rulings on Karn confirm that the current game ends and a new game begins, and that no one wins, loses or draws the game that just ended. That means, if this was game 3, the match is recorded as 1-1.

As for Shahrazad, there's an Urban Legend that I whined & cried so much about having to answer questions and settle arguments that WotC just went ahead and banned it to preserve my sanity. (There is some doubt as to whether or not that was effective… heh!)

And, yes, the universe will implode. It's already happened, several times. Perhaps that's why that card got banned?

On a more serious note: since it's only legal in Casual formats, do what makes sense to the players in that game. If you can't agree, then agree to ban the card like so many others have…

d:^D

Sorry to correct Scott, but there's a precedent ruling about this (on the old rules and judge lists, which admittedly are hard to search…).

2011/5/19 Dave Unni<dev_unni@hotmail.com>:

It is game 3 and the players are in turn 3 of turns. It is player A's turn and he/she controls Karn Liberated with 14 loyalty counters on it. If he/she proceeds to use the -14 ability of Karn Liberated what happens to the game and match? Do the players shuffle up and play with whatever remaining turns are left or does the game never get to start? I am leaning towards they shuffle up and play the remaining turns since it is the same game just restarted. If this is the case is it still turn 3? This almost came up at my local release but I'm sure with standard season upon us that we will see it happen at least once.

You will restart the game. The first turn of the restarted game will
be turn 4. It's still the same game for purposes of reporting games
for the tournament. Players may not sideboard while restarting the
game.

Daniel Kitachewsky
L3, Paris, France
MTGRules-L Netrep